adccommunitymod (AutomationDirect) asked a question.
Created Date: February 21,2018
Created By: scotbirmingham
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I'm using a red lion HMI and a do-more plc in a production facility. I have a duplicate installation to test changes but i don't always have access to it. Both red lion's Crimson software and Do-More Designer have built in simulators but it'd be nice to be able to connect them so I could see how things really work together when I don't have access. I'm curious is there's anyway to make these simulators talk to each other. Does the Designer simulator have an IP address that could be used? I thought 127.0.0.1 might work but it doesn't seem to. Neither does my PC's IP address. I saw one reference to using modbus TCP to connect to the simulator but it's hard for me to understand why that would be different that using the built in do-more connection protocols s that redlion comes with. Regardless, all the software is written with the do-more communications protocols and it would be a major piece of work to change it now. Perhaps the fact that I'm running both pieces of software on the same PC is the issue. If I run them on different PC's could I connect them? Any help is appreciated. Thanks.
Created Date: February 21,2018
Created by: scotbirmingham
I'm using a red lion HMI and a do-more plc in a production facility. I have a duplicate installation to test changes but i don't always have access to it. Both red lion's Crimson software and Do-More Designer have built in simulators but it'd be nice to be able to connect them so I could see how things really work together when I don't have access. I'm curious is there's anyway to make these simulators talk to each other. Does the Designer simulator have an IP address that could be used? I thought 127.0.0.1 might work but it doesn't seem to. Neither does my PC's IP address. I saw one reference to using modbus TCP to connect to the simulator but it's hard for me to understand why that would be different that using the built in do-more connection protocols s that redlion comes with. Regardless, all the software is written with the do-more communications protocols and it would be a major piece of work to change it now. Perhaps the fact that I'm running both pieces of software on the same PC is the issue. If I run them on different PC's could I connect them? Any help is appreciated. Thanks.
Created Date: February 21,2018
Created by: BobO
Either the local host address or the PCs address will access the Do-more sim. That's how DmD talks to it, so there is nothing preventing it from working. Don't know anything about the HMI sim though. It might be a firewall thing.
Created Date: February 21,2018
Created by: Adisharr
I remember getting that to work a few years ago but I don't remember any of the details. I know the Red Lion simulator will time out after I believe 15 minutes or so. You just need to run it again.
Created Date: February 22,2018
Created by: OkiePC
In Crimson 3.0, go to Link, Options, at the bottom area called "Panel Emulation " click configure, and then select what you want each virtual ethernet port to be pointed at. The default is disabled. In your case, you might need to specify some virtual port created by the DoMore software.
Created Date: February 23,2018
Created by: scotbirmingham
Thanks. I feel like that's gotten me a lot closer but it still doesn't seem to work. I 've found that while connected to the simulator, I can open XY configure and see the simulator's IP address, subnet, and gateway. I also found the emulation configuration box in crimson and added an ethernet port. You 're right Adisharr that if you give the emulator an ethernet port, it limits the session to 15 minutes. Now that I have the IP configuration for my simulator which is my ip address, (IP 192.168.11.123, subnet 255.255.252.0, Gateway 192.168.8.1) I would think that I could put the subnet and gateway into crimson, give it a different IP address in the same domain (I tried 192.168.11.225) and put my ip address as the do-more's address. Unfortunately that didn't seem to work. If anyone else has any insight I'd love to hear it. I feel like I'm so close but networking isn't my strong suit.
Created Date: February 23,2018
Created by: OkiePC
I have not used DMD, but did have version 2.0 installed, so I tried to open an example and connect a Crimson Emulated HMI to it. What I found is that the IP address of the simulated PLC took the same IP address as my laptop network interface, and I am not experienced enough with DMD to know if that can be changed or where to do so. I tried to edit the IP address while connected but the software changed it right back. Offline, I could not access a port configuration for the Simulator. Maybe I am not looking in the right place.
I think if the emulated PLC did have a unique IP address on the same network as my laptop and the Emulated HMI then it might work. Having the same IP address as the laptop itself is probably a show stopper.
I also tried to use a serial port, but the Do-More only lets me choose COM200 as the mapped serial port, but the Red Lion emulator won't go past COM8...bummer
Created Date: February 23,2018
Created by: BobO
I have not used DMD, but did have version 2.0 installed, so I tried to open an example and connect a Crimson Emulated HMI to it. What I found is that the IP address of the simulated PLC took the same IP address as my laptop network interface, and I am not experienced enough with DMD to know if that can be changed or where to do so. I tried to edit the IP address while connected but the software changed it right back. Offline, I could not access a port configuration for the Simulator. Maybe I am not looking in the right place.
Since DMSim runs the actual PLC code, it has the comm functions there to change the IP address, but doesn't change the PC's NIC settings. Pretty sure doing so wouldn't be popular with users.
I think if the emulated PLC did have a unique IP address on the same network as my laptop and the Emulated HMI then it might work. Having the same IP address as the laptop itself is probably a show stopper.
IP addresses are associated with NICs, not apps. When DMSim runs, it just listens on port 28784 (0x7070) and does not specifically bind to an adapter. DmD makes no specific provision to connect to DMSim (as opposed to a physical PLC), it just establishes a normal link to 127.0.0.1, but the primary NIC IP works fine as well. I don't know what the HMI sim does, but there is no such limitation in DMSim.
I also tried to use a serial port, but the Do-More only lets me choose COM200 as the mapped serial port, but the Red Lion emulator won't go past COM8...bummer
DMSim is simply listing the ports that are currently configured on your PC. You can change the PCs serial port mapping in the Windows device manager.
Created Date: February 23,2018
Created by: scotbirmingham
Thanks everyone. It does seem to be an issue on Crimson/Red Lion's end, specifically with their do-more network protocol which probably doesn't get a lot of attention. When I use the do-more specific protocol, I can't get it to connect but I made a test HMI program using the modbus tcp protocol I then I can interface with the modbus registers of the do-more. I use my pc's network address for the PLC specification in the HMI program and it connects fine. Doesn't really help my situation today as I'd have to rewrite 90% of the program to make that change but it's certainly good learning for the future.
Created Date: February 23,2018
Created by: OkiePC
Good info, Bob, thanks! The Red Lion HMI allows you to communicate through the mapped ethernet port to real hardware and has its own IP address separate from that of the PC NIC. Obviously in order to work, the IP addresses of the emulated HMI, the PC NIC, and the real hardware need to be compatible in order for them to all "talk ". I had no luck using the PC NIC address or 127.0.0.1 trying to link to the DM Simulator.
@ scotbirmingham : How did you get it to work with Modbus TCP protocol? I tried several things to no avail...I have no dog in this fight, but now I am challenged!
Thanks.
Created Date: February 24,2018
Created by: BobO
The Red Lion HMI allows you to communicate through the mapped ethernet port to real hardware and has its own IP address separate from that of the PC.
Those definitely exist, virtual adapters. Not too common for apps though, generally used with network services. Most apps just sit on the stack and leave network management to the OS. I'm sure the HMI sim can be coerced into playing, but who knows what that takes. I'm sure it's easy once you know. ;)